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Messages posted by: dkoh  XML
Profile for dkoh -> Messages posted by dkoh [246] Go to Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 Next 
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paultaylor wrote:

nickeaston wrote:
Paul's promo says "watch a folder and automatically fix songs added to that folder" so my question is: What would the practical maximum folder size be? (...and what definition of "duplicate" would be used?) 

A Watch folder, watches for new files being added, the size of folder is not relevant. It watches for new songs and fixes them but does not de-duplicate them, however that is an interesting idea I hadn't considered and I will consider further to see if it is practical. 

I stumbled upon this early on and thought it was a bug. Once explained, it makes sense.

Like Paul said, it is only new files to that folder. If you select a watch-folder with 20k files already in it, nothing happens. If you drag an album folder in, it will get processed and the rest left alone. There's no size limit cos it's not loading the contents of the watch folder, only monitoring changes. There's no limit on what can be dragged in either, except you will be waiting a while to process 500 megs.

Here's the reasoning:
You point the watch folder to your main collection, nothing happens (we should assume it's already been Fixed). You want to file some new songs, SK will process, name, and move the new stuff you just dragged in.

The size of your collection may warrant a different watch-folder, but not for directory-size reasons. My collection is large enough that I wouldn't be able to see any changes file-wise. I prefer to use a "New Songs" directory as a holding dir and as my watch-folder. Here I can visually see that things are changing correctly and then I move them over to my main pile manually.
I've been a fan of dbpoweramp for years, wasn't even aware of Asset. Unfortunately (actually thankfully), I gave up completely on uPNP and switched to XBMC about a year ago. However, it's not a style frame, it's just different behavior for Grouping. I'm not really sold on the Grouping/Styles thing yet, as some people (DJs) actually use Grouping for more important things and not appropriate for styles.

Keep in mind that Apple is "above" the ID3 spec and is not afraid to implement things that do not conform. They are not really something to follow, but adapt to.

@Dieter Stockert
Classical is always going to be a PITA to categorize. Even music majors do these "renaissance with a bit of baroque, inspired by blah blah" descriptions. I'm one of those with a dozen albums, and you're right, I give them the basic genres cos when I want Sibelius, I go to Sibelius.

- Here's my long-winded stance/opinion/situation.
I used to gloss over genres cos nothing utilized them nicely. As we started accumulating devices around the house I realized I should start putting genres in.

I switched to XBMC about a year ago from uPNP/PS3, and found it has a lot of nice sorting features (read: usable). This is where I went nuts on genres.

The 1st problem is that they're subjective. The second problem is the user-submitted genres (Musicbrainz, lastfm, discogs), not only are there those debates about "such-n-such isn't real punk", but also things like "Should be public domain" as a genre all over Musicbrainz. Useless

After a lot of searching, I found that allmusic uses a set list of genres for the reviewer to pick from. They're not always exactly how you would classify stuff, but they were very consistent and predictable. Their hierarchy also makes a lot of sense with how they categorize their Styles (See http://www.allmusic.com/genres). Of course, you could always tweak your own.

Now, how to get these into Jaikoz? There are (too) many posts around here (from me) about genres. The path I take currently is I put everything from allmusic into the genre field. The genres are always the first, followed by the styles. I use an Excel function to create my string, and once pasted into Jaikoz it becomes a multi-value, but the frame is really a null-delimited string.

BUT, XBMC isn't working with null delimiters (there is no null character in XML. It's being worked on, and possibly already fixed in a nightly, but I'm holding out for Frodo in a few months). So currently it will only show the first genre in the frame which is only 14 or so according to allmusic. When XBMC fixes the null issue, all genres and styles will show up. I guess it will be a memory thing differentiating the genres from the styles, but see below "My Master Plan".

BTW, a while back this was also working properly with Apple. We no longer have Apple in the house so I can't check anymore. I wouldn't be surprised if it's broken though.

My Master Plan
I'm not sure how to achieve this yet, baby steps. I want to go to the Genre list and only see the 14 allmusic genres. I want that to expand the appropriate styles which would return the applicable albums. I'm hoping I can just write some XML exceptions to separate the genres/styles, but the XBMC window behavior is something I can not change unless I learn some programming. If this grouping field styles thing becomes the norm, I can simply open 50k songs in Jaikoz, copy and split the entire genre column in Excel, and paste them back in.

I realize I'm putting all my eggs in one XBMC basket here, but the functionality is the same as any device potentially could have. IMO XBMC is king currently (when you consider it as the entire entertainment package it is), but the next successful solution will not be worse and my tagging scheme should still be appropriate. Unfortunately, this whole genres thing will not get resolved without some collaboration or until somebody sets a new standard.
It's hard to advise without your structure details and file count. AFAIK, There is no "turn off everything but AID" setting. Jaikoz uses whatever's available and turning things off will only limit the returned results.

If you have NO meta, I would suggest you enable the "filename" column and copy the entire column to the 'Title' column, <song>.mp3 and all. If it's just a couple artists, I would fill those in too, to the 'Artist' and 'Album Artist' columns. If it's a ton of different artists or too many to figure out then leave them blank. Then try the AC and see what you get.
Are you referring to allmusic and the sub-genres?

Example (on the left):

If this is the case, then there is no such thing as a Style tag in the ID3 standard. I have also yet to find a player that supports a Style tag.

And yes, I would love for Jaikoz to have this functionality. However, we're at the mercy of ID3.org here.

<edit> Christ, a double-post... never mind. http://www.jaikoz.com/jaikozforum/posts/list/30/1291.page
In my experience, absurd results come from absurd queries.

Assuming you have Paul's settings above and things still aren't working, you can do some things to troubleshoot your own files:

- It appears you have Artist, but not Album. You can sort by Artist, then run the AC only on that artist. This rules the VA releases out completely.
- If you can't get release matches on just that artist, you'll need to single out an album. This is easy if you have things filed by folder. Otherwise, try singling out the files for just one release. Referencing MB would be wise. Run the AC on this one album. This rules out any compilations or reissues.
- If the AC still won't find it, then you can try "Match to specified" and enter the MBID you used to single out that album. This will usually give you an error, like "track nn not found", "nn songs required", or a bunch of time discrepancies. This rules out your files; if it still won't match you have some seriously wrong settings.

You're dealing with some popular music, but it is entirely possible that your album is not in MB yet, which you should have caught at the second step. If that's the case join MB and add it in.
Something I forgot to mention, since you're dealing with Comments:

Pasting a Comment with line breaks in the Edit pane is treated as multi-value. So if you were to copy the entire biography from http://www.allmusic.com/artist/metallica-mn0000446509 and pasted them into a selected range in the Edit pane, you would get a different paragraph in each cell. In this case you would go to the Info tab, paste the entire comment for one track, then copy/paste the rest of the values in the Edit pane.

paultaylor wrote:

jdhill93 wrote:

B. If I select the comments for multiple tags and enter delete, it deletes the comment for only the last tag selected. Not good. No benefit to multiple selection.

Yes detail panel only ever shows metadata from one song, Ive never liked the way iTunes does it because its not clear what youy are modifying when try to show a merged viiew of multiple songs.

I think jdhill is referring to the Comments field in the Edit pane, not the Details pane. I still find myself doing this occasionally also. Like Excel, I select a range and hit delete and expect the range to be deleted, but only the last one is deleted.

To me it makes sense if you select fields and immediately hit delete, those fields are deleted. If you use the Details pane and clear out the Comment field, it would only clear for that one track, like you mentioned.

jdhill93 wrote:

C. If I select comments for a single or multiple tags and delete via right click/delete or the menu edit/delete, it deletes the entire row entry(ies). Not Good. There is no indication that entire rows are selected for the delete operation as opposed to just the comment field entries. Also, there is no indication as to what is actually being deleted. Is it just deleting the tag data in the database, or the entire song datafile on my disk?

You need to keep in mind that the toolbar always applies to everything regardless of what you have selected, and the right-click context menu only applies to what you have selected.

The only way to delete the physical file is to 'Delete File' or 'Delete Duplicates'. Hopefully you have the Status column enabled, where the purple indicates changes, deleted files will become red and will only be deleted upon Saving. You can also undelete if you delete by mistake. Once you are aware of the red status, there should be no confusion.

jdhill93 wrote:

E. If the selected comment entries are different, however, the Detail Pane shows a blank and I can find no way to delete the data there. Entering delete or backspace has no effect. Only workaround I've found is to enter something, say X which inserts an X in each tag, and then revert to method D above. Again, a slow process.

I don't get this either (maybe the last field in your selection is blank?), but I think you're taking the slow route with Jaikoz. If you want to copy - say, comments - select the first comment, ctrl+c, select all the other cells, ctrl+v (or RMB>copy and paste). It's a standard OS copy too, so you can copy comments from last.fm and paste them into Jaikoz. You can also drag one field to another to make a quick instance copy.

If you need to make a quick text edit in a field, just double-click that field and directly edit it.

To delete, you should be selecting individual fields and RMB>Delete. Keep in mind that you can drag ranges for selection or ctrl+click individual fields. Dragging a range and then unselecting a single cell doesn't work properly, though. You have to ctrl+drag two ranges around what you want to exclude.

There are also column headers that you can use to fill or clear the entire column. RMB on the header (eg. "Album") and you'll see paste and empty.

I say all this cos it sounds like you're using the Details panel for a lot of your editing. In fact, very little is done down there and the bulk of your raw editing is done in the Edit panel Excel-style.
Is Watch Folder supposed to create a log? I realize it's not supposed to display one, and it does create one with just a header, but should it be incomplete?

This is the HTML one BTW, things still show up in the debug log.

*edit - Shit, nevermind. I was running it, dropping folders in, and looking at the log. When I hit Finish the log displayed complete.
Good point. I do things a little backwards from that; Cleaning things up in a "New Songs" folder, then moving them into the shiny clean place.
Hmmm. I'm on both sides of this one.

I personally would prefer to see all non-music and non-art files trashed.

I can see how it would be easy to sort out the garbage in the old folders left behind, but that's assuming they're named bad in the first place and easy to spot. It's a little different when "Wonderful World" gets renamed to "A Wonderful World". I also dropped my jaw when I filed a large artist (I think it was Pink Floyd) and most folders were duplicated.

I could vote either way on this one, as I just search in the OS and delete anyways. What convinced me to file this issue was I asked myself, "Is it SK's job to manage misc. files?"
Was it intentional to only have the year for the Date?
Also, if there's a subfolder inside the album full of images, those also do not get moved.


The 'covers' folder will stay behind in the original folder.
Again, I don't know if this is intentional or not.

I dropped a bunch of trash files from my desktop into an album folder an ran SK with a folder renamer (creates a new folder and moves contents on save). These types were:

After SK, only the two images (JPG GIF) moved. Should everything else be moved?

paultaylor wrote:

dkoh wrote:

If you are experienced in Jaikoz, you might find yourself annoyed with the lack of control (I am _). It IS a one-button fix, but once you hit "go", that's it, no guidance.

Yes it is one click, but before you click there are 5 tabs of options you can modify so you still have a fair bit of control. What options are you missing, if there is demand I can add some in. 

It's the mental thing of hitting Fix and watching those green bars and wondering what it's going to spit out, whereas in Jaikoz you see everything before it saves. It's just something to get used to, not a 'lack of feature' thing. New users who have never used Jaikoz will probably experience none of this.

paultaylor wrote:

dkoh wrote:

Keep in mind that' you can't use it to change artwork, label things "EP" or "Remastered", or edit genres. It's a "match this" and that's it. 

You mean manually change artwork ?
You can add (EP) to the release title using the 'Add EP .." option on the Format tab  

You're at the mercy of whatever artwork MB gives you. If it's scratchy, faded, small, wrong, missing, there's no way to change it in SK.

Yeah, I forgot about the EP setting. SK does use the values from the release "Type" from MB. Things that I usually add to the release tag are (Remastered) and (Special Edition). This is when I have both original and remastered or deluxe copies from my favorite artists (like the Megadeth collection). This isn't necessary for most users, but if I don't relabel them, XBMC will see them as one giant release with duplicate songs. I would suggest this as a new feature, but MB disambiguation isn't all that great. XBMC is working on reading MBID from tags soon anyway, so this task might go away for me.

I don't want anyone to think I was badmouthing SK. That is not the case, and I was merely giving a warning to Jaikoz users that things may be different than what you're used to. Last night I ran an artist folder with 9 albums, all mixed MP3, FLAC, and WMAs, and was expecting things to get messy. It ran through all of them except for one track that had a large time discrepancy. Dropped them straight into Jaikoz and everything looked as it should. I was very impressed.
It is still in Beta and you might get some changes that you didn't want!

With that said, make some copies of some albums and try it out. If things are completely unfiled, feel free to edit them as it won't really damage them, it just might put them in the wrong folder or mistag something. For a jaikoz user, this is all easy to repair. I've been using it heavily for two days now and I've never gotten to a place I don't want to be.

If you are experienced in Jaikoz, you might find yourself annoyed with the lack of control (I am _). It IS a one-button fix, but once you hit "go", that's it, no guidance.

I think most avid Jaikoz users know who exactly who this is pointed at:
- It's the guys at work/friends who ask "What do you use to get all that info in there?", so you point em to the Jaikoz trial and they give up after about 10 minutes.
- The iTypes who want better info but want something "automatic".
- The Wife! "I don't need to know all this! Just make it pretty!".

Once the bugs are worked out, I think this will be fabulous, and might even act as a "halo" product for Jaikoz (I don't know why it gets so little attention, maybe it needs a sex-tape). I'm already using the beta with 'regular' releases and then throwing them in Jaikoz for finishing touches, and there isn't much else to add; All the MBIDs and AcoustIDs are already there, along with all the basic tags you'd expect.

Keep in mind that' you can't use it to change artwork, label things "EP" or "Remastered", or edit genres. It's a "match this" and that's it.
Yeah, the "beta" topic is displaying only that one thread and Paul is working on it.

I finally found the logs, and since you're going to be using it soon... Once you do a correct it creates a report and it will open a HTML in a browser, if you go to that path you'll find everything you want.

For Winderz:
I've searched my entire C: drive but can't find it.
I'm not posting an issue yet cos I don't know if this is normal behavior.

Is the JS mask behavior different than Jaikoz? I tried:
 Album + Title

but the files won't save.

I can hit OK out of the mask editor, Fix will find all the info, but it's always "0 files saved". The default AlbumArtistorArtist preset WILL save at the end, and it seems that anything that starts with:

will also work.

I realize that it can't save blank filenames if the mask is broken, but shouldn't the user be halted at the mask screen? Or is there something wrong with simple masks?

I'm an <title>.mp3 kinda guy so I have only "title" in Jaikoz and it renames fine.
Ha! I submitted one too. I've been stuck at 497 for a while now, gave up trying to get to 500.
Certainly not very useful or a feature request or anything, I just remembered seeing the command and thought I'd try it out.

I was filing a bunch of different artist files and the last hundred-some were Ozzy Osbourne. I thought I could just "Paste to End" the Artist and Album Artist and then I got some confusing results.

Now I know, and knowing... is half the battle.
Gotcha, I was assuming wrong.

I was thinking you could copy a value, say (in Excel terms) cell B28, and "Paste to End" and have cell B29 through B40 pasted in.

How is "Paste to End" supposed to work? I assume that I can copy the Artist field and "Paste to End" and it's supposed to paste every Artist field to the bottom, but instead it pastes only into the selected cell with a space inserted for the first character.

Am I assuming wrong or is it broken?
Can you make 'esc' close the genre/artwork/artist/any other multi-value dialogs?

That's it, Thank you.
This was happening back on 461 and the next release had fixed it. Sorry I didn't report back with it working.
Wait, what exactly is your situation? Are you still loading a bunch of randoms and trying to match individual albums out? If so, and you're not getting what you want, you'll need to apply a bit of human intelligence.

I would run the AC on everything and that should get at least the Artist. Then I would group the artists by clicking the "Artist" column header and try to AC only one artist at a time. If that isn't working then you'd have to do something like the Manual Corrector or selecting tracks from a known album or pasting the album name in, etc. When you run the AC, if an album is missing one track or one of those tracks has a short time on it, the AC will not see this as an album to use, which is prolly why you're getting all those VA releases.

When I first used Jaikoz on my mess I found I had a TON of incompletes. It was a lot of work to clean up and usually quicker to re-rip or DL the really messed up things.

amix wrote:

It's not the genres. It's the fact, that way over 60% of album names I got were "Best Of...", "Top Of The Crop", "Super Smash Hits Collection". And this makes me think, that the whole Musicbraiz database is not really usable anymore. Because, as far as I remember, it wanted to focus on original releases first, then on any other release, second. It may be interesting for some people (none come to my mind) to know about every single release on a song on a "Best Of Rock'N'Roll", that has been issued in Africa or Asia (or from Europe for the people from these continents) but it is not really interesting for the average home user. Do you have a little bit of background info, what happened to MusicBrainz or why I get these results?  

Search results are only as accurate as your queries, in this case your music collection. Jaikoz takes any existing tag info (if any), track times (I think it's ±3s), and AcoustIDs into account and returns what it thinks is correct based on what you've provided. If you have a sloppy collection, you'll get sloppy results.

I'm curious though - since you rip down from FLACs, and assuming your FLACs are genuine rips - if there's something else going on. What happens if you find the MBID you want and Action>Match to Release>Match to specified? Do you get a "song duration" or "cannot find track xx" error? If that's the case, then you likely have a problem with your files.

And why can't I simply take the MusicBrainz ID (or any other) and enter it into the search form and get a result at their site? 

You can, but not really a search. Just copy/paste the MBID behind http://musicbrainz.org/release/. You can do the same for /artist/, /release-group/, etc. Or, in Jaikoz, you can View>View This (thing) at Musicbrainz.

paultaylor wrote:
The error is an incompatability with the latest version of jaudiotagger lib and Jaikoz.

The problem is the Artist Official Url field (WOAR Frame) , I have devised a fix for this but could you please both confirm this is the only issue you are having my deleting the Artist Official Url field and seeing if Force Save now works. 

Confirmed. Deleting only that field allows Force Save.
Do you have "iTunes Compatibility" checked?
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